Why Do Alabama Sheriffs Oppose Constitutional Carry? It’s All About the Money!

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Madison County Sheriff Blake Dorning. You can read his open letter on why the ASA opposes SB24. (Photo: AL.com file/Bob Gathany)

Let’s be real, when people say “It’s not about the money,” chances are it’s really about the money.

Case in point, the Alabama Sheriffs Association opposition to SB24, a Constitutional Carry bill that would allow one to carry a concealed firearm without having to pay a fee and obtain a permit.

Publicly, sheriffs argue that doing away with the permit system would jeopardize both the safety of the public and that of sworn officers.  But really, it’s about the money, specifically their permit fund.

“In my opinion and the opinion of most law enforcement officials and agencies, this is bad legislation due to the fact it adds additional danger to law enforcement officers performing their duty of protecting and serving the general public,” said Monroe County Sheriff Thomas Tate in an interview with The Monroe Journal.

Likewise, Pike County Sheriff Russell Thomas told The Troy Messenger, “We’re always going to put public safety first and there’s a lot of concern about individuals being able to carry guns without background checks.”

Right. The worry is about people carrying guns without background checks. Hmmm… What a bunch of claptrap!  Four quick reasons why it’s a load of B.S.

  1. In Alabama a background check is required at the point-of-sale when one purchases a firearm from a licensed dealer.
  2. Aside from in a vehicle, open carry without a permit is legal in Alabama. In other words, any lawful citizen can already carry a firearm without having to undergo another background check.
  3. Speaking of law-abiding citizens, they’re not the problem here! Criminals are the problem. You know, bad guy with guns. But they, as we all know, will carry concealed firearms irrespective of what the law says. Moreover, given their criminal history, they are already banned from merely possessing, let alone, carrying firearms in the first place.
  4. As many as twelve states have passed Constitutional Carry laws and, thus far, not one has descended into chaos and disorder. Not one.

The Sheriffs opposition to SB24 is, as mentioned, only about one thing: the money. In a private email obtained by AL.com, the money motive was made abundantly clear by Alabama Sheriffs Association Executive Director Bobby Timmons, who told members to contact their local legislators and to tell them to oppose SB24 “if you value your permit fund.”

Timmons went on to say that they should also oppose any attempt at a compromise version of the bill that would benefit law-abiding gun owners.

“The National Rifle Association WILL return next time the Legislature meets to bring back Jabo [Waggoner’s] ‘any county bill’ and will push for uniform — one cost — statewide permit fee…if any fee at all!” wrote Timmons.

Yes, it’s about their precious permit fund.  That’s why ASA opposes SB 24.

Now, where does that revenue go? What is that permit fund used for?

Chief Deputy David Jernigan of Madison County said that it is used for the “betterment of law enforcement.”

“There’s been a lot of misconception about where does the money go,” Jernigan said in a Feb. interview with AL.com. “I’ve heard over the last several days, the money goes in the sheriff’s pocket, I’ve heard it’s a slush fund.

“We take in close to $700,000 a year in pistol permits. That money, by local legislative action, is for the betterment of law enforcement in Madison County. It is subject to state audit. It has been audited in the past and it continues to be audited to make sure we are spending the money in the best interests of our communities.”

Specifically, Jernigan said the money is spent on new vehicles, police training, and new technology such as radios, body cameras, laptop computers, and tasers.

“Without technology, you’re almost going back 20 years to a deputy who just has the basics,” Jernigan said. “I really feel this community wants a professionally trained and a professionally equipped law enforcement agency to go out and protect the public.”

Okay, while that may be true that a community wants their boys in blue to have the best equipment available, isn’t it also true that the community should have a say on whether that financial burden should fall on the backs of those who wish to exercise their fundamental right to keep and bear arms?

There’s also some irony here in that concealed carriers have the potential to actually increase public safety thus making law enforcement’s job easier. Why would the ASA actually want to keep a permit system that inhibits more responsible people from carrying firearms for self-defense?

Those seem like reasonable questions to me.

Look, I understand that municipal budgets are being cut left and right around the country and a lot of the time police departments take the brunt of that loss in funding, but it doesn’t seem right for the ASA to oppose a bill that would restore the 2A rights of law-abiding gun owners (as the founders intended) merely because it hits the Sheriffs’ discretionary fund for new gadgets and gear.

What’s more is the ASA should be honest about its opposition to the legislation.  Don’t cry “officer safety” or “public safety” when there is virtually no evidence to suggest that Constitutional Carry hurts either.  Tell the public the truth.  You want money for new stuff.  Honesty is always the best policy.  That holds true for law enforcement as well.

{ 78 comments… add one }
  • Chris Baker April 12, 2017, 4:20 pm

    If you have to ask permission, your right has been infringed.

  • Dave McConnell April 10, 2017, 9:53 pm

    This was a pretty good article as far as it went, but it only rehashed facts that most people with one or more functioning brain cells have long been aware of. Of course it is about the money. What logical reason is there to pass laws that actively help criminals and put law abiding citizens in danger? There is also the fact that a unarmed population cannot protect themselves from corrupt government actions.
    Logic will tell you that the whole concept of “gun control” is flawed, and based on the concept that passing a law will actually prevent a criminal from getting a weapon. Unfortunately, the liberal gun grabbers know full well that they cannot sustain their position with logic and facts, so they wage their campaign using outright lies, half truths, false or misleading statistics, and fear mongering to further their goals.
    But I must ask the aforementioned liberal gun grabbers to HONESTLY answer this question. When one or more thugs kick in your door at 0 dark thirty, or assault your family at the local park, what would you rather have in your hand. A cell phone or a gun?

  • Jon Will April 10, 2017, 12:51 am

    This sheriff sounds like he’s from California. Go on out there sheriff you’ll be real welcome there….I guarantee it. You’ll fit right in with all the other libtards.

  • 2Bornot2B2A April 9, 2017, 2:16 am

    In my county it cost me $20.00 for CCW permit per year here in Southern Alabama. Big deal, 20 bucks? I paid for a 5 year permit. The entire process took 10 minutes from when I walked in the door, to getting my picture taken and handing me my permit and walking out the door. And my record is not spotless but I have no major crimes. If this helps keep my LEO up to date for their gear such as body cams, cruisers, etc so be it. I’m actually happy to contribute to a better prepared police presence. Yes there are bad cops as well as good cops which is a shame as they are held to a higher standard but this is the Ying and the Yang just as with everything else. When I left Texas 3 years ago it cost $150 for a CCW class, $150 for the permit not to mention the ammo and weapon of choice, so no I have no problem giving my local Sheriff’s office a hundred dollars every 5 years. I am all for 2A, member of NRA, USCCA and others and think there should be a few checks a balances that don’t really infringe upon our rights and helping the local MCSO is a bonus, IMHO. I know I’ll hear the quotes “God given rights”, “shall not infringe”, etc. but I conceal carry for my protection, that of my family and friends and if need be, a stranger in distress. I do not want anyone knowing I am armed until I need to produce my sidearm for the good. When I purchased a long gun and presented my CCW license, that was all that was needed to satisfy the background check, done and out the door I went.

  • Open Carry April 8, 2017, 2:41 am

    Fine all you Sheriffs out there that think all civilians are bad guys. The next time some law enforcement person is getting his ass kicked and head beaten into the pavement by a real bad guy, you can watch from on your back as me and my CC turn a blind eye and stay back out of the way.

  • Doc Loch April 7, 2017, 9:55 pm

    Taxation is theft! Always has been always will be.

    • Dave McConnell April 10, 2017, 10:00 pm

      Sorry, Doc, but I must disagree. Taxes are a necessary evil in order to run a government, from federal down to town or city level and provide infrastructure and other services.
      In part, though, I must agree. When you waste tax money on pork projects, useless grants, studies on the sex life of African monkeys, etc., THAT is irresponsible use of tax money and should be punished.

  • Tarheelz April 7, 2017, 6:56 pm

    Madison County Alabama Sheriff’s Department is very professional as is Blake Corning.

  • Greg April 7, 2017, 5:06 pm

    More of the “To Serve and Protect” folks ripping off those they’re supposed to be protecting. How does ripping residents off for their 2nd Amendment rights translate to serving and protecting?

    There’s something stinking here and it smells like bullschit.

  • NCFubar April 7, 2017, 3:53 pm

    The same can be said about North Carolina’s Sheriff and the NC Sheriffs Assoc is going hard against it here. They also want to keep the Pistol Purchase Permits ($5 each from you good ole local Sheriff) that date back the the Jim Crow era. Also it is a power trip for the 100 elected Sheriffs who think they should have the right to determine who is “of good character” in the PPP issuance. There are some individuals who can pass the NICS check and buy a long gun but for a reason the Sheriff does not deem the “of good character” enough to be able to buy a handgun.

    • Mikial April 7, 2017, 6:03 pm

      You have to have a permit to buy a pistol in North Carolina? Wow, that really disappoints me, I’d have thought a good old southern state would be more open to individual Constitutional rights?

      • Roger reeves April 8, 2017, 1:27 pm

        I am a FFL dealer. I think k the background check by John doe is necessary. It should qualify a individual to own and carry a handgun. The $loo.oo fee for a carry permit is a joke. When l do a background check and it is approved, why should the Sheriff get l00.00 just to get a pocket permit. My BG check should surfice. Put teeth into the gun shows where non FFL guys sale as no permit . As stated, the criminals will get their guns regardless. The carry fee is just another fraud tax. A FFL dealer should be able to sell the pocket firearm if Feds approve the sale.

  • Greg April 7, 2017, 3:38 pm

    Follow the money. I have no problem with the citizens of a state wanting to have some input regarding someone’s capacity to responsibly carry a firearm. I also have no problem with citizens insisting on the expense of licensing CCW to be borne by licensees. But the argument that freedom to carry is all about the 2nd Amendment and nothing about the money naively misunderstands the influences of gun manufacturers on public opinion. Remember to follow the money. That having been said: and to better state my perspective: I am both a licensed CCW holder and FFL03 collector.

  • PETE OSTERGARD April 7, 2017, 3:25 pm

    I have a CCW and went through hell to get it here in Callyforny. I do feel it’s wise for applicants to have to pass a carry course and qualify on a range. As far as the fees go, they’re way too high here but if they’re using them to bolster their departments and keep them up to date I don’t have a problem. I kinda look at as pay them now or pay them later. If they need money for training or equipment they’ll get through taxing us one way or another. It’ll all come out of the same pockets.

    • rev_dave April 7, 2017, 5:46 pm

      Same amount of money but taking it in permit fees means the it comes out of far fewer packets and only gun owners. Raising taxes in general allows the anti-gun voters to participate in their own protection as well as feeling the sting of their vote.

    • Mikial April 7, 2017, 6:07 pm

      I’m glad you were able to get your permit. But the high fees are simply there to keep guns in the hands of the people who can afford the fee and not in the hands of some poor minimum wage worker who lives in a mobile home. California does everything it can to work towards a society made up of two classes of people, the wealthy Liberals and the poor who the wealthy Liberals control.

      • walt April 10, 2017, 7:18 pm

        I am surprised that you got a permit in California a all. In southern Calif. you can count the permits on the fingers on one hand. I had to buy a business that was permit friendly to get mine. Cost $8 per year. Then LA city didn’t like it. Now I live in a eastern state and one permit is good for about 16 states, he is good for the state I live in.( about $65.00 )each. But what is your life worth.

    • Dave McConnell April 10, 2017, 10:07 pm

      Pete, I can, in part, understand your opinion. There are a lot of people I know that have no criminal record yet they have no business owning, let alone carrying a gun, but they can legally buy one. So unless you propose making someone take firearms classes and be able to qualify with whatever weapon they buy, making CC folks do this will not substantially improve public safety.
      As for giving money to law enforcement, perhaps you and all the other voters in good old California could ask your elected officials to give up one or more of their pork projects. If this happened, California law enforcement at all levels would then be the best equipped and trained officers in the world.

  • Tom A April 7, 2017, 2:10 pm

    I think it’s always important to follow the money. I also think it’s always important to consider both sides of any issue. Do these officers have valid concerns apart from the funds some departments may collect for themselves through these permits? I think there are some valid reasons why it’s best that we don’t go around like its the Wild West again. We all love freedom and guns but unless you live in Wyoming or rural Texas it’s best to come to some reasonable consensus with the rest of the population in a given area, be that county, like in NC where I live, or city or whatever.
    And an additional thought.. Who keeps the lights on at Guns America? Should we not follow the money as they ask us to? Are there not financial pressures, incentives, and transactions that take place here to help them shape ‘our’ opinions? How much support have they received from Remington to convince the public there were never any issues with the somewhat infamous m700 trigger? Or to convince us their cheaply made new pistol was worth your hard earned dollar when other reviewers said it probably wasn’t? I read these articles because I enjoy the perspectives but if they are asking us to be critical then I will also hold them to similar standards. Follow the money…

    • Mikial April 7, 2017, 6:15 pm

      “I think there are some valid reasons why it’s best that we don’t go around like its the Wild West again.”

      Have to take issue with that statement. What you are advocating is that while criminals will never hesitate to carry a gun illegally, it should be difficult for a law abiding citizen to carry a gun legally to protect themselves against criminals and terrorists. Home invasions by armed criminals are not at all uncommon, neither are armed robberies, muggings and rapes. Terrorists walk into malls, nightclubs and restaurants and shoot multiple victims for no apparent reason, most often in paces where law abiding citizens obey ridiculous laws or rules that forbid them to carry a gun to protect themselves.. Please explain to us how that is somehow preferable to what you are describing as the “Wild West.”

  • Dennis April 7, 2017, 1:34 pm

    It’s the money in Alabama part two:
    So if we are going to have a CC permit and we feel that there should be some additional control over who can “legally” carry (no prevention of illegal carry intended) a gun “concealed”(a point that some miss) let’s estimate how much it coast the Sheriff to issue one and charge that State wide. Based on my estimate of time (I know how much she makes and it takes me more time to fill out the paper work than it takes her to issue the permit) and material it looks like about $1. And let’s make it $75 for a lifetime permit.

    What do you think?

    • Arnold Arnold April 7, 2017, 5:45 pm

      Why do I have to “ask permission” from any government and then PAY that government for what is defined as my God-given RIGHT in the United States of America Constitution!
      2nd Amendment is my carry anywhere and anyhow permission…. period….
      .
      As for the baffooonery I have been reading here…. Yo-Yo’s & Yehoo’s with guns usually become extinct…
      just say’n …;-)

  • Dennis April 7, 2017, 1:07 pm

    Ladies and Gentlemen;
    I live in Alabama and it is all about the money. My county charges $20 per year for a CCP. The lowest amount charged here, that I know of, is $8 per year. That county has the largest population. About 55% of the adult population has a concealed carry permit in my state. If you do the math on the largest county it works out to be about $2,000,000 per year. If you do the math on my county that’s about $500,000 per year for the Sheriff’s Dept. Actually in my county it is probably closer to $600,000 since most people here have a permit.

    Now what Sheriff’s Dept. would want to give up that kind of cash

    • Darryl April 7, 2017, 3:45 pm

      the thing is they shouldn’t come to rely on that money has they should know the way things are going on around the country it could go away at anytime because of the way the law changes. sorry i don’t feel for them. instead of have ever new gadget they should go about keeping touch with the people they are supposed to serve. i know their job is hard but it seems their more in to head busting then serving. i know because i have run with a lot of cops before and i can tell you fist hand they like it when they have hit the lights and the chase is on along with the head busting.

  • Patrick Duffy April 7, 2017, 12:34 pm

    We have constitutional carry in Wyoming. The biggest issue is that people are carrying without any training. Several instances of guns being dropped in stores and discharging – one woman injured shot through the arm. We should term it “Careless carry”. Also when the police stop a vehicle their check identifies if the owner has a CCW. It makes it more difficult for them with non CCW carriers.

    • Darryl April 7, 2017, 3:51 pm

      and i have read more stories of cops leaving their guns here or there, gun going off when cleaning it, that’s always a good. how many of the ones who CC and have the 8hr. training and no more after that? i’d be willing to bet that there are more cops that have done thing such as this but it is not talked about as they have different rules and laws for themselves as they are the ones that are suppose to tell no each other or themselves, never going to happen.

    • Arnold Arnold April 7, 2017, 4:41 pm

      Throw’n a BIG ol’ BSflag here on Patrick Duffy!!!!! Something that MIGHT have happened ONCE in a ten State radius in the last ten years is hardly the case for this Fear Mongering the unholy hell out of the Great State of Wyoming…. Good Grief!!!
      .
      True story…. WY State Patrolman pulls a Colorado fella over and he hands the Trooper his “papers” with CCW permit…. Trooper gives back the permit and tells the fella… “We have an agreement around here; you do not show me yours and I will not show you mine…..”
      .
      😉

      • Chris Baker April 12, 2017, 4:27 pm

        That’s a cool attitude. Definitely a good cop!

  • Ken April 7, 2017, 12:17 pm

    I really do believe that all law abiding citizens that can legally own a firearm should, it they want to. As to carrying it in public that is another story. The so called Constitutional Carry is a problem in two ways. First, it allows anyone who can pass a background check (no major criminal record) to carry a firearm in public with out any training what so ever. John Doe, who doesn’t have a record or only class b or c misdemeanors on their record and has a very short fuse, can carry a gun. Is this what carrying for self defense is about. Everyone of you out there knows or have seen people who lose their cool at the drop of a hat. Do you want those people carrying around your family? They don’t have training either, they strap it on and think now they can stop a crime. It is not the CCP holder’s job to play cop, it is to defend their self, family, and friends or even a stranger (if they know the situation), but they think they can, because they have never been introduced to the laws concerning deadly force. How many of you see the people who feel entitled to everything as good candidates for responsibly carrying a firearm? I am all for 2nd Amendment rights, but the old saying about with great rights or powers come great responsibility. Too many people I have seen do not want the responsibility, nay, obligation to train if they don’t have to. I don’t want those people with that attitude to have ready access to a firearm, one can hope that the time it takes them to return to their vehicle or home to retrieve their firearm will give them a chance to cool down before doing something stupid.
    Second problem, if we want a truly National Reciprocity or even National license, would it not behoove us to want to have a training curriculum that will satisfy most of the States and give a little more peace of mind to each different State that there is a minimum training standard for firearm handling as well as deadly force laws. I feel that we will never get anywhere near that goal if we don’t agree to standards of training and a way to certify that a person has gone through and has an understanding of those rights and responsibilities.

    • Jimmy Mills April 7, 2017, 3:02 pm

      In Montgomery County a background check and $20 are the only requirement.s No training required, in fact you need a concealed carry permit BEFORE taking the Sheriff’s Dept training course.

    • Tom A April 7, 2017, 3:10 pm

      This!

    • Darryl April 7, 2017, 4:01 pm

      if it was a perfect world maybe this would be true, but it’s not. if things were or could be as bad as everyone thinks who against Constitutional Carry we would be reading about it everyday in the news because the liberal’s would love this so they couldn’t wait to throw it in our faces so to me none of this is true about open carry or Con. Carry. no matter what you are always going to have a in anything so should the other 99.9% have to do what a few others think they want them to do? so if you don’t like Con. carry or Open carry that;s ok but don’t make others have to do something they don’t want to just to enjoy the RIGHT they were given by our fore fathers. we don’t ask that you do anything different just because we don’t agree with you.

    • Chris Baker April 12, 2017, 4:33 pm

      Constitutional Carry with no permits should be the law of the land if the government followed the constitution. Instead of passing all these unconstitutional laws that restrict gun owners, the folks who don’t like it should work to amend the constitution. That’s why the process is there.

      2nd Amendment: “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”
      Requiring a permit is an infringement. Forbidding certain types of weapons is an infringement. Barring weapons from certain areas is an infringement. The Second Amendment IS my concealed carry permit.

  • Dexter Winslett B,ham. PD Retired April 7, 2017, 10:48 am

    Only a coward will give away rights for security. All men ought be armed. Government has no right to control open, concealed, or any type carry!

    • Darryl April 7, 2017, 4:03 pm

      just what i think. even our founders said so way back when, those who would give up rights for a little security don’t deserve either one.

  • Don T April 7, 2017, 10:37 am

    I’ll admit, I haven’t read this rather long article or the comments. May do so later. However, I’ve been thinking about this lately. I was sitting in a local Chic Fil A eating a sandwich with my daughter and was thinking, suppose someone walked into Chic Fil A with an AR or AK. My first response would be to try to get my daughter to cover and also for me to take cover and prepare to get a clean shot. So if someone walks in with a rifle or even a pistol, unless they are Law Enforcement, I can fairly accurately assume their intentions are not good and begin to take appropriate action. However, if people are allowed to walk in with them openly, then I would not know what to expect, so I would have to assume they are OK until they start shooting.
    If you are like me, when you think of open carry, you think of people wearing their handgun in a holster, however this is not always the case. Ohio has open carry, and people walk around stores with long guns. This is problematic at best. Concealed carry works well. I’m glad Florida just stuck down open carry again. If you are fishing, hunting or camping, you can open carry but even this, dumb people go out on a crowded pier in a larger city and open carry, claiming they are fishing. The police didn’t agree. I know many won’t agree and that’s fine but I think those who are not allowing open carry have valid concerns and not just $, as Law Enforcement doesn’t get the funds I pay for my concealed carry license anyways.

    • JT April 7, 2017, 1:22 pm

      It is legal to open carry in Ohio, but concealed carry does require a permit. I’m now 60 and have lived most of my life in Ohio, primarily in exurban and rural areas. During that time, I have seen ZERO people open carry. I can pretty much guarantee that if you open carry in my county, someone will freak out and call LE. I personally don’t care to be constantly stopped and interrogated by police, nor do I wish to advertise the fact that I’m carrying a sidearm. Not saying you’re wrong Don, but in my neck of Ohio open carry is non-existent.

      • Darryl April 7, 2017, 4:15 pm

        Don, easy way to tell what someone is going to do if they walk into a place carrying a long gun is if they have it over their shoulder not going to do anything, in their hands pointing at people good bet their up to no good. i don’t really think that you duck for cover overtime someone comes in with a long gun on their shoulder, but maybe you do. as far as open carry i do where i live and never had anyone go running and screaming or had the cops called on me. i have been around a lot of cops open carrying and none have said a word. i mean really if things were so bad with open carrying you would be seeing it on the news everyday. all this is a bunch of fake news spread by mouth and never happens. now there may be the once in a while type thing but you’re never going to have it perfect, never so i think for the most part lawful people with guns are good people and it’s been shown that gun carriers are the most law-abiding folks out there.

        • Dave McConnell April 10, 2017, 10:24 pm

          Darryl, I think that open carry is a concept that falls in the area of “I have the right to do this, but is it the right thing to do?” If you live in a area where open carry is allowed, and if open carry is a common occurrence, no worries. But can’t you see the potential for bad things to happen when open carrying in a area where it is not a common practice, especially with all the mass shootings in the last few years? At the very best, it will frighten some people, and it takes little imagination to think of worst case scenarios.
          Strange, but as a veteran, I find myself once again supporting a position that I personally don’t agree with.

  • robert April 7, 2017, 10:21 am

    This is the same the same old political thing, that it happening all over our country, and it does all revolve around politics, money, control and power. An officer like this guy is the biggest reason law enforcement has loss respect, among some of our society. When law enforcement can instantly protect all of our citizens, from the criminal element and our own government. then our citizens will no longer need guns. That day is not here yet. This man thinks like a politician, “I should have a gun or several armed bodyguards to protect me, because I am important. But the average guy should not have a gun to defend himself.” Well, maybe he can have a gun if he is willing to pay me, that would make everything alright. Our politicians think that they should not be subject to the same laws as the rest of us, they are right, the laws governing them should be even more strict, and the penalties more punishing, because of the position they hold. The politicians in our country have run wild and are accountable to any one, they think.

    • Darryl April 7, 2017, 4:21 pm

      so true, when was the last time you heard of a politician going to jail for breaking the law, not state but the ones in federal jobs. when you have them sending naked pics of themselves to girls under age and their still walking the streets should tell you a lot. i read a story about some little 23 year old singer, that know has really read of tell her bodyguards to step outside because she wanting to do a little kissing with her boyfriend. you think she is going to care about others rights given to us by our fore fathers to have the right to protect ourselves? no she’s not she has her protection.

  • 358 April 7, 2017, 10:11 am

    Considering the courts let so many jerks off the hook simply because the system is overcrowded, I am against carry without a background check. Maybe carry should be free (no money involved) but I feel safer requiring a background check.

    There was a recent case here in Atlanta where two guys had been arrested 15 times and still hadn’t been convicted of anything. Do I want them carrying legally…nope! Perhaps our laws would still allow people like them a permit, but the process of obtaining a permit would surely discourage some of them.

    • Dave McConnell April 10, 2017, 10:31 pm

      Yes, it might discourage some criminals. Actually, it would probably discourage most of them. Why go through all the trouble and paperwork when they can just buy a gun from a local street gang?

  • Jonathan D Olenick April 7, 2017, 9:48 am

    To be able to carry concealed a person should have to have training in the legal ramifications thereof, and to prove proficiency. Jon.

    • Wayne Cook April 7, 2017, 10:01 am

      In every single state, a course in law is required for ANY carrier. The law requires the applicant to prove proficiency on the range as well.

      • Edi April 7, 2017, 10:22 am

        You’re are wrong. Where do you get your facts?

      • Ziggy April 7, 2017, 10:31 am

        I don\’t think you are correct here Mr. Cook. When I got my permit in New York State twenty-some years ago there was no required course or range proficiency. They don\’t make it easy (sometimes impossible) to obtain a permit to carry but beyond the paperwork hassle they don\’t seem too concerned. Perhaps things have changed but not to my knowledge. My the way, NYS requires you to have a pistol permit if you even want to smell the oil on a handgun, whether or not you intend to carry concealed.

      • Joe April 7, 2017, 10:55 am

        You are wrong in your assumption Wayne. In Alabama you only need cash and no felonies in your background and you have your CCW. The Sheriff in each county determines what licenses cost. In Mobile County it is $20 a year or $100 for five years.

    • Alan April 7, 2017, 11:02 am

      Ugh!! Where does the Constitution guarantee anyone any level of safety???
      It doesn’t, that’s the individuals responsibility. By Natural Law.
      The SCOTUS even found that the Police have NO obligation to the safety of the individual, only to the people as a whole.
      By advocating this crap, it puts the power to deny people their Natural Right to self defense in the hands of Police and legislators.
      And it makes it so a poor single mother (or anyone else) finds herself at the mercy of an ex whatever because she couldn’t afford the time or money to go through the Fascist process to secure that which is her natural right.
      If someone is injured by another due to carelessness with a firearm, it is NO DIFFERENT than that of being injured by a car or any other object in our society, and that careless person must then pay the price of their carelessness.
      So how is the burden of operating a car different than that of a gun? Only in ONE respect, the gun is part of a NATURAL RIGHT. And Natural Rights should not be restricted (in ANY form) by Govt. entities.
      It’s this kind of thinking that leads to more regulation, and only a fool fails to see where that has lead in us in history.
      I’m sorry, but that thinking gets me incensed, it removes the ideals of Natural Rights, and brainwashes the people with ideals of the ‘State’.

  • Michael Keim April 7, 2017, 9:45 am

    Sheriffs are elected officials. That makes them politicians. Politicians are first and foremost about the money.

    • Wayne Cook April 7, 2017, 10:01 am

      Touche.

    • JT April 7, 2017, 1:27 pm

      Partially. I’d say money is secondary to acquiring power and keeping it (re-election).

  • LUIS PARELLA April 7, 2017, 9:42 am

    I this is the way that this sheriff is doing unlawful action the people that put him there can fired him, SEND HIM PACKING KNOW AND GO TO THE DEPT OF JUSTICE AND SUITE HIM..

    • Z April 7, 2017, 10:42 am

      Suite him?

      • JT April 7, 2017, 1:28 pm

        Yeah, you know, give him a nice suite.

  • thomasjefferson April 7, 2017, 9:24 am

    Alabama has more than it’s fair share of corrupt thugs with badges. When I was young, stupid and didn’t know any better, I went down to the sheriff’s office in Cleburne Co. Alabama to “get my permit”. It cost $5.00 back then. I went in to see the sheriff. He said, “that’ll be $5.00 son”. Out of my wallet came the $5.00, and INTO HIS WALLET went my $5.00. I literally stood there and watched him take my $5.00 and stuff it into his wallet.
    Of course, since then, I educated myself and now realize that I do not have to grovel before a corrupt bureaucrat and pay a “fee” to exercise a PAID PRIVILEGE, when I can simply exercise a GOD-GIVEN RIGHT for free. Very simple people, cut out the CORRUPT middle-man. Personally, I don’t give a damn WHAT their local laws, ordinances, codes, etc… say. If they are in diametric opposition to the Constitution for these united States, then is simply is of non-effect. (Marbury vs. Madison)

    • Wayne Cook April 7, 2017, 10:02 am

      Excellent point and personal history.

  • thebiggourdhead April 7, 2017, 9:22 am

    Money plus power and control. The same crap is going on in Kentucky.

    • deanbob April 7, 2017, 10:17 am

      I bet one could find at least 1 county in every state that is similar. It is up to each state to rein in this bad behavior.

  • Charles Williams April 7, 2017, 8:27 am

    If I were a profiler my immediate read on this guy is power hungry. He looks as though he is getting ready to run for Mayor the first chance he gets. It’s in the dismissive expression in his face. He knows that no one knows what he knows (which is a psychopathic trait). Perhaps the citizens of Madison County need to reconsider when he next runs for office.

    • Edi April 7, 2017, 10:25 am

      If it’s not about the money make the “permit” fee free and see how far that goes.

      • Z April 7, 2017, 10:43 am

        Did you even read the article? Yes, it’s absolutely about the money.

  • Alfred Friend April 7, 2017, 8:04 am

    Just so we are ALL honest here. The vast majority of LE management and government who have control over them primarily think about the money. Here are some facts:
    Over 31% of revenues for agencies/depts who control LE budgets come from traffic violations or fees.
    Over 91% of that money goes to general funds to support political items. (generation of more revenues or more government)
    Less than 6% of municipalities or counties look at true safety when chasing fines and fees. (follow the money)
    IT’S NOT ABOUT THE MAJORITY OF GOOD, WELL TRAINED LE OFFICERS. BUT, they need to start standing up for the truth and not for fear of their jobs. Fascist states got their start from these exact circumstances. If you don’t stand for what is right, you are just as wrong as the law breakers and evil people. The day of reckoning always comes and your actions will be your path to good or bad. Part of serve and protect is to the people pay the taxes, not your political bosses.

    The easy path is not always the best path.

    • Wayne Cook April 7, 2017, 10:06 am

      Well said, and proven over and over again. Not just in our country either. I faced the exact same things in several other nations.

  • Dan April 7, 2017, 7:31 am

    TJ, your right its only the 10 percent of LE that let power go to their heads! But, that 10 percent rules when it comes to public opinion! I don’t have a problem with LE using the money that they get from Drug offenders for what every equipment or technology they need! But, I do have problem with LE taking my honest earned money to allow me to own or carry concealed when it’s already granted in the Constitution . If you do the crime you pay the fine!

    • Alan April 7, 2017, 9:39 am

      With respect, the Constitution ‘Grants’ us nothing, it is a Declaration of our natural rights (God given, for those who believe) written to inform tyrants where we stand.

  • Dr Motown April 7, 2017, 7:26 am

    If you need $700,000 for the “betterment of law enforcement,” pass a mileage and make EVERYONE share the cost burden equally

  • Larry C April 7, 2017, 6:43 am

    As said, if it is about money, say so. If you truly need the money, the burden should be spread on the entire community not just a fragment. Put it in a general tax. This is not the only case where laws are designed not for what is claimed but for a surreptitious way to raise money. There are many places where the speed limit is so ridiculously low that it encourages driving in excess of limit. Do note that often in such case the road is designed for a police car to be able to hide with a radar to catch so-called speeders. The speed limit sign is often difficult to spot. I know of one case where over $80,000 is raised every year due to speeding tickets.

  • Rob April 7, 2017, 6:14 am

    ““Harass, intimidate, EXTORT and arrest”……the motto of LEO’s everywhere” You Sir, are an idiot. A certified card carrying IDIOT!.
    I live in a State where the right for non-permit concealed carry was passed last year. Our local Sheriff supported it whole heartedly. The money he received for the permits wasn’t enough to cover the wages of the employees that it required to implement and maintain.

  • Dilligaf April 6, 2017, 2:23 pm

    “Harass, intimidate, EXTORT and arrest”……the motto of LEO’s everywhere

    • Tj April 7, 2017, 4:49 am

      Well dilligaf, I hope that’s not your true feelings about LEO’s. As a volunteer reserve officer I don’t HARASS, Intimidate, EXTORT or arrest. I uphold the law. I’m sorry if you have had a bad experience with Law enforcement but we are human and unfortunately there are those that do let the power go to their heads but a very miniscule amount so please don’t judge us all.
      Thank you,
      Tj

      • Ron Stidham April 7, 2017, 6:29 am

        Well said Tj, I agree with you. There are a lot of good officers on foot with the intent of protect and serve.
        When it comes to a well trained department, who doesn’t want the best.
        But be honest about the whereabouts of the money, and what it is intended for.
        That alone should hold some sway with the public you are charged to Protect and Serve.

      • ToddB April 7, 2017, 7:20 am

        We keep being told ‘its just a few bad apples’. When most of us outside LE know its not true. Out of 5 personal interactions with LE, only 1 was positive. Does that mean I just had the luck of finding the ‘miniscule amount’? Well lets see there was a long time friend, he told me how corrupt the sheriff was in his county, rural TN. Well until he got his badge, then everything was fine. He never gave up his other job as pot dealer, now could drive as fast as he wanted, didn’t have to wear seat belts, and could drink and drive. Whos gonna stop him, he actually laughs about it. Or the retired one my ex knew, he was pretty open about his past corruption. I live in a small town all of 3800 people, yet the cops here seem to think its downtown Baghdad. I got stopped for not quite stopping for a rural stop sign, fine I did it, not exactly the crime of the century. His hand never left his gun, he was actually ticked my paperwork came back clean. My elderly neighbor got stopped outside town, that cop had his hand on his gun the whole time. The guy is 70 and everybody knows him. Or the small town ticket scam here in TN, they stop you, always write a ticket, then suspend every one, not some, but every one. The city keeps the $75 ‘court fee’. At least TN cut out their traffic school scam, made them do the whole 8 hrs, it was only profitable when they could do in 30 min. They simply stopped writing the tickets. Who is it fighting curbs on civil forfeiture, cops of course. Oh but your pro criminal if you want to rein it in. No were pro rights. The ones LE seems to forget we have. So save the ‘its just a few bad ones’ bit. Respect is earned, not inflicted.

    • Bob April 7, 2017, 7:24 am

      Pretty negative view. In my 40 years as a government employer, that involved a lot of travel, I’ve been stopped by the best which include the Texas Border Patrol, Texas State Police, Kentucky and Indiana State Police and a few locals in all three states. Mainly for minor traffic infractions.
      I can not recall any one incident where I was harassed and, quite frankly, I was given the respect I gave them.
      Attitude has a lot to do with it. When you are stopped your hands need to be on the steering wheel in plain sight and the only words that should come out of your mouth is “yes sir” and “no sir”. The officer doesn’t know you from Adam and he or she would probably like to make it safely back to their family after their shift.
      Every group has a bad onion, police included, but one disrespectful cop doesn’t make them all bad.

      • Tim Smith April 7, 2017, 8:12 am

        I’ve had nothing but good interactions with LEOs. Granted, I’m a law-abiding citizen. But when pulled over early this year for going a little fast, I immediately told the officer I was armed and offered him to disarm me if he so chose. After the incident, which resulted in a warning only, he thanked me for being a responsible gun owner and supporter of the 2nd amendment. Common courtesy offered first is often returned!!

      • Mikial April 7, 2017, 6:18 pm

        Agreed on the interactions, but that that have to do with police wanting control over carry permits? Bad guys don;t buy their guns legally and they don’t apply for permits to carry them.

    • Alan April 7, 2017, 9:34 am

      Nothing worse than an all encompassing declaration of fascism in an otherwise sensible discussion.
      Such statements are the bane of intellect, and serve only to make us wonder after the logic and experience of the one making such statements.
      I know many LEO’s, most are no different than any of us. And several I consider to be good and honorable people.

    • Cam April 8, 2017, 9:59 am

      Not everywhere but a lot, I drive over 30,000 a year mainly in the south and south east. My employer runs a dash cam system in my vehicle that record speed, time, location, cameras etc. I’ve been pulled over numerous times in numerous municipalities and been harassed in many. “You know why I pulled ya over” I reply usually for no reason and after I explain that all my info is recorded and they realize they can’t lie and say I was swerving or speeding they let me go. I had 1 lie and say my headlight was burned out but if I submitted to a search of the vehicle he would not write me a ticket. I said I would like to exit the vehicle to see and take a picture of the headlight for my court date he said I could not exit on the highway for public safety. Then said your going to take the ticket? I said yes and he said I could leave. I exited the nest stop got out and checked and guess what all lights were working.
      All cops are these day is an after or a revenuer. They show up after a crime and fill out a report like when my office or house were robbed. Doesn’t matter that both were monitored and after being called by the company and explaining I was 3 states away and the police were called, I came back 2 days latter to find the door still ajar. The police never checked. Guess since I paid the city’s alarm license and they knew they couldn’t ticket me for that they couldn’t be bothered. When I called the cops to report the break in and theft they still didn’t show. They took the info for the report over the phone.
      The only thing else they are doing is taxing people by giving them tickets. It funny I got a buddy who got his second dui, and more than anything all the court wanted is the cash. He kept saying no I would rather just go to jail and that he would not pay fines or other expenses.,After almost a year the judge finally sent him to jail for 6 months, he turned himself in a county, they processed him and released him the next days. It’s all a money scam.

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